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	<title>Comments on: The Scholars &amp; Rogues Manifesto: what are we doing here?</title>
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	<link>http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/2008/12/03/the-scholars-rogues-manifesto-what-are-we-doing-here/</link>
	<description>Think - it ain&#039;t illegal yet...</description>
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		<title>By: Steve</title>
		<link>http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/2008/12/03/the-scholars-rogues-manifesto-what-are-we-doing-here/comment-page-1/#comment-59453</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Dec 2008 22:44:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/?p=5656#comment-59453</guid>
		<description>That doesn&#039;t excuse their inability to change the feel of the music. I don&#039;t mean the lyrics, lyrics are fine, but RATM definitely suffers from &quot;you&#039;ve heard one song, you&#039;ve heard them all.&quot;

JT, if I recall, Neil Young recently expressed his disappointment, claiming he&#039;s lost faith in the ability of one song to change the world. The malaise isn&#039;t just yours.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That doesn&#8217;t excuse their inability to change the feel of the music. I don&#8217;t mean the lyrics, lyrics are fine, but RATM definitely suffers from &#8220;you&#8217;ve heard one song, you&#8217;ve heard them all.&#8221;</p>
<p>JT, if I recall, Neil Young recently expressed his disappointment, claiming he&#8217;s lost faith in the ability of one song to change the world. The malaise isn&#8217;t just yours.</p>
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		<title>By: jeff watson</title>
		<link>http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/2008/12/03/the-scholars-rogues-manifesto-what-are-we-doing-here/comment-page-1/#comment-59450</link>
		<dc:creator>jeff watson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Dec 2008 20:39:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/?p=5656#comment-59450</guid>
		<description>But ROTM has nothing to complain about as their gross sales are very solid.

Jeff</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>But ROTM has nothing to complain about as their gross sales are very solid.</p>
<p>Jeff</p>
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		<title>By: JThompson</title>
		<link>http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/2008/12/03/the-scholars-rogues-manifesto-what-are-we-doing-here/comment-page-1/#comment-59449</link>
		<dc:creator>JThompson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Dec 2008 19:21:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/?p=5656#comment-59449</guid>
		<description>Sadly the closest thing to protest music nowadays is bands like Rage Against the Machine and Rise Against (Songs like &quot;The First Drop&quot; in particular). Hardly the stuff of the 60s and 70s, though I listen to both from time to time.
You kinda get the feeling RAtM gets pissed off when the sun rises. Anger for anger&#039;s sake, instead of being angry about a specific thing. And then the people that cheered the songs of protest go home and do what they do every single other night without giving it another thought. It&#039;s depressing, but it almost seems like society in general has lost its ability to be moved by music.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sadly the closest thing to protest music nowadays is bands like Rage Against the Machine and Rise Against (Songs like &#8220;The First Drop&#8221; in particular). Hardly the stuff of the 60s and 70s, though I listen to both from time to time.<br />
You kinda get the feeling RAtM gets pissed off when the sun rises. Anger for anger&#8217;s sake, instead of being angry about a specific thing. And then the people that cheered the songs of protest go home and do what they do every single other night without giving it another thought. It&#8217;s depressing, but it almost seems like society in general has lost its ability to be moved by music.</p>
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		<title>By: jeff watson</title>
		<link>http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/2008/12/03/the-scholars-rogues-manifesto-what-are-we-doing-here/comment-page-1/#comment-59429</link>
		<dc:creator>jeff watson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Dec 2008 02:00:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/?p=5656#comment-59429</guid>
		<description>Lex,

I agree with you about the state of country music.  That being said, I&#039;ve found that even today&#039;s faux country stars really like to take care of their fans.  They&#039;re much more accessible than their pop/rock counterparts, despite the corporate bullshit.  I will go to see a country show when someone good is in town, and am usually never disappointed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lex,</p>
<p>I agree with you about the state of country music.  That being said, I&#8217;ve found that even today&#8217;s faux country stars really like to take care of their fans.  They&#8217;re much more accessible than their pop/rock counterparts, despite the corporate bullshit.  I will go to see a country show when someone good is in town, and am usually never disappointed.</p>
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		<title>By: Russ Wellen</title>
		<link>http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/2008/12/03/the-scholars-rogues-manifesto-what-are-we-doing-here/comment-page-1/#comment-59419</link>
		<dc:creator>Russ Wellen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Dec 2008 17:34:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/?p=5656#comment-59419</guid>
		<description>I second the manifesto.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I second the manifesto.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve</title>
		<link>http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/2008/12/03/the-scholars-rogues-manifesto-what-are-we-doing-here/comment-page-1/#comment-59418</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Dec 2008 17:29:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/?p=5656#comment-59418</guid>
		<description>jeff, you&#039;re not a troll. Persona non grata...maybe a shade...but Lex is more correct with &quot;loyal opposition.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>jeff, you&#8217;re not a troll. Persona non grata&#8230;maybe a shade&#8230;but Lex is more correct with &#8220;loyal opposition.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Ann Ivins</title>
		<link>http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/2008/12/03/the-scholars-rogues-manifesto-what-are-we-doing-here/comment-page-1/#comment-59412</link>
		<dc:creator>Ann Ivins</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Dec 2008 15:41:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/?p=5656#comment-59412</guid>
		<description>Created. Totally created. Like the Disney Princess phenomenon. Twenty-year-old bottle blondes (ahem) and pseudo-homegrown, metrosexual cowboys.  Please.

Bob Wills to Lyle Lovett. Patsy Cline to Lucinda Williams. Jerry Jeff Walker to Robert Earl Keen. k d lang, may she live forever. That&#039;s the organic evolution of country music. I grew up forced to listen to Gary Stewart, Lacy J. Dalton, Emmylou Harris, Johnny Cash... and now &lt;i&gt;Red-Headed Stranger&lt;/i&gt; never leaves my car&#039;s CD player, and &lt;i&gt;Teatro&lt;/i&gt; soothes me when nothing else can, and I am proud of having known the lyrics to &quot;I Can Get Off on You&quot; before I even knew what weed and cocaine were...

Yes. Manufactured. Pap for the masses.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Created. Totally created. Like the Disney Princess phenomenon. Twenty-year-old bottle blondes (ahem) and pseudo-homegrown, metrosexual cowboys.  Please.</p>
<p>Bob Wills to Lyle Lovett. Patsy Cline to Lucinda Williams. Jerry Jeff Walker to Robert Earl Keen. k d lang, may she live forever. That&#8217;s the organic evolution of country music. I grew up forced to listen to Gary Stewart, Lacy J. Dalton, Emmylou Harris, Johnny Cash&#8230; and now <i>Red-Headed Stranger</i> never leaves my car&#8217;s CD player, and <i>Teatro</i> soothes me when nothing else can, and I am proud of having known the lyrics to &#8220;I Can Get Off on You&#8221; before I even knew what weed and cocaine were&#8230;</p>
<p>Yes. Manufactured. Pap for the masses.</p>
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		<title>By: Lex</title>
		<link>http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/2008/12/03/the-scholars-rogues-manifesto-what-are-we-doing-here/comment-page-1/#comment-59410</link>
		<dc:creator>Lex</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Dec 2008 14:40:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/?p=5656#comment-59410</guid>
		<description>You don&#039;t really feel that abused, do you, Jeff?  When it comes to straight politics you&#039;ve probably got a much different voting pattern than most of the regulars, but i don&#039;t think that the idea of loyal opposition has been lost here. (Granted, sometimes discussions get heated but that&#039;s to be expected.) On the economics front i thin that whythawk and you are probably fairly close, and even the most liberal here are smart enough to see that &quot;free markets&quot; are not the root of all evil.  In any case, i appreciate your comments even when i don&#039;t agree with them.  

On music: i&#039;ve long been disturbed by the rise of Corporate Country.  (Don&#039;t get me wrong, i love old school C&amp;W, particularly Cowboy Jazz and the &quot;Outlaw&quot; variety, but what floods the airwaves today is mostly crap...MTV with a twang.)  I used to think that it was just part of America&#039;s redneck fetish - and not real rednecks either, but poseur rednecks, but after reading this piece and thinking on it i&#039;m no longer so sure.

Was popular culture purposefully rednecktified?  Were the airwaves flooded with what passes for country music today as a preemptive strike against music&#039;s ability to unite a counter-culture? (True, pop music is often and always has been pretty shitty, and C&amp;W is a lot like the new pop.)  Was the market for Nashville organic, or was it created?  Any thoughts?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You don&#8217;t really feel that abused, do you, Jeff?  When it comes to straight politics you&#8217;ve probably got a much different voting pattern than most of the regulars, but i don&#8217;t think that the idea of loyal opposition has been lost here. (Granted, sometimes discussions get heated but that&#8217;s to be expected.) On the economics front i thin that whythawk and you are probably fairly close, and even the most liberal here are smart enough to see that &#8220;free markets&#8221; are not the root of all evil.  In any case, i appreciate your comments even when i don&#8217;t agree with them.  </p>
<p>On music: i&#8217;ve long been disturbed by the rise of Corporate Country.  (Don&#8217;t get me wrong, i love old school C&amp;W, particularly Cowboy Jazz and the &#8220;Outlaw&#8221; variety, but what floods the airwaves today is mostly crap&#8230;MTV with a twang.)  I used to think that it was just part of America&#8217;s redneck fetish &#8211; and not real rednecks either, but poseur rednecks, but after reading this piece and thinking on it i&#8217;m no longer so sure.</p>
<p>Was popular culture purposefully rednecktified?  Were the airwaves flooded with what passes for country music today as a preemptive strike against music&#8217;s ability to unite a counter-culture? (True, pop music is often and always has been pretty shitty, and C&amp;W is a lot like the new pop.)  Was the market for Nashville organic, or was it created?  Any thoughts?</p>
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		<title>By: jeff watson</title>
		<link>http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/2008/12/03/the-scholars-rogues-manifesto-what-are-we-doing-here/comment-page-1/#comment-59392</link>
		<dc:creator>jeff watson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Dec 2008 04:44:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/?p=5656#comment-59392</guid>
		<description>Dr, Slammy, You said,
&quot;I don’t use that word in any sort of conventional, partisan sense. By “progressive” I mean more enlightened; better educated; more appreciative of the cultural arts; better informed about the forces shaping our world; more productively spiritual (and less dogmatically sectarian) in our approach to life; more generous and charitable; more tolerant and more willing to understand the value of diversity; more committed to community and the common good; more literate; more intellectually curious and prone to critical thought; more responsive to the well-reasoned than to the passionately felt; and above all, more insistent that those we choose to represent us, to lead us and to govern us be the best America has to offer, not the worst.&quot;

That sounds like me.  Although I&#039;m considered the troll, have personna non grata status around here, and am tolerantly ignored,, I am actually the embodiment of the spirit of your paragraph.  That&#039;s a good thing despite the rancor, insults and invective hurled my way, we can all come together.


Jeff</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dr, Slammy, You said,<br />
&#8220;I don’t use that word in any sort of conventional, partisan sense. By “progressive” I mean more enlightened; better educated; more appreciative of the cultural arts; better informed about the forces shaping our world; more productively spiritual (and less dogmatically sectarian) in our approach to life; more generous and charitable; more tolerant and more willing to understand the value of diversity; more committed to community and the common good; more literate; more intellectually curious and prone to critical thought; more responsive to the well-reasoned than to the passionately felt; and above all, more insistent that those we choose to represent us, to lead us and to govern us be the best America has to offer, not the worst.&#8221;</p>
<p>That sounds like me.  Although I&#8217;m considered the troll, have personna non grata status around here, and am tolerantly ignored,, I am actually the embodiment of the spirit of your paragraph.  That&#8217;s a good thing despite the rancor, insults and invective hurled my way, we can all come together.</p>
<p>Jeff</p>
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		<title>By: Dr. Slammy</title>
		<link>http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/2008/12/03/the-scholars-rogues-manifesto-what-are-we-doing-here/comment-page-1/#comment-59384</link>
		<dc:creator>Dr. Slammy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Dec 2008 01:32:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/?p=5656#comment-59384</guid>
		<description>Thanks, Bob - although we&#039;ve certainly been called pretentious (and worse).....  :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks, Bob &#8211; although we&#8217;ve certainly been called pretentious (and worse)&#8230;..  <img src='http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Bob</title>
		<link>http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/2008/12/03/the-scholars-rogues-manifesto-what-are-we-doing-here/comment-page-1/#comment-59383</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Dec 2008 00:34:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/?p=5656#comment-59383</guid>
		<description>Your definition of &quot;progressive&quot; was spot on.  That&#039;s what I enjoy about this site and the writers who post as well as my companions here in &quot;the peanut gallery&quot;.  It&#039;s difficult to actively seek enlightenment and yet remain unpretentious. This blog does that beautifully.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your definition of &#8220;progressive&#8221; was spot on.  That&#8217;s what I enjoy about this site and the writers who post as well as my companions here in &#8220;the peanut gallery&#8221;.  It&#8217;s difficult to actively seek enlightenment and yet remain unpretentious. This blog does that beautifully.</p>
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		<title>By: Dr. Slammy</title>
		<link>http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/2008/12/03/the-scholars-rogues-manifesto-what-are-we-doing-here/comment-page-1/#comment-59364</link>
		<dc:creator>Dr. Slammy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Dec 2008 16:11:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/?p=5656#comment-59364</guid>
		<description>Thanks, Lex. I&#039;ve said a number of times that we take great pride in our comment threads. That was actually one of our primary goals when we set out.

Sure, we get some morons and trolls now and again, and we certainly don&#039;t feel any need to agree with what our commenters have to say (or each other, for that matter), but seriously, compare our threads to what you find most other places and tell me what you see.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks, Lex. I&#8217;ve said a number of times that we take great pride in our comment threads. That was actually one of our primary goals when we set out.</p>
<p>Sure, we get some morons and trolls now and again, and we certainly don&#8217;t feel any need to agree with what our commenters have to say (or each other, for that matter), but seriously, compare our threads to what you find most other places and tell me what you see.</p>
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		<title>By: Lex</title>
		<link>http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/2008/12/03/the-scholars-rogues-manifesto-what-are-we-doing-here/comment-page-1/#comment-59363</link>
		<dc:creator>Lex</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Dec 2008 16:03:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/?p=5656#comment-59363</guid>
		<description>Excellent essay, Dr. Slammy.

When i point people here, i always put political in quotes to indicate how much more there is at S&amp;R.  I generally describe this place as a meeting place of smart, articulate people with diverse interests, opinions and knowledge.  You never know what you&#039;ll find on any given day, but it will always make you think.  And, for the most part, what happens here are conversations.  Look at how many people use their real names and how few people caps lock their statements.  I&#039;d call it the internet equivalent of an old fashioned Salon.

I believe that i first came here to read the Weekly Carboholic about a year ago.  I&#039;ve never left because i felt immediately at home, and surmised that this is what the internet should be...or here is potentiality actualized. (And no, i&#039;m not just saying that because i&#039;ve been given the opportunity to post...for those non-regulars reading this.  I&#039;m honored to have that opportunity because i feel that way about S&amp;R.)

Thanks for all your hard work.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Excellent essay, Dr. Slammy.</p>
<p>When i point people here, i always put political in quotes to indicate how much more there is at S&amp;R.  I generally describe this place as a meeting place of smart, articulate people with diverse interests, opinions and knowledge.  You never know what you&#8217;ll find on any given day, but it will always make you think.  And, for the most part, what happens here are conversations.  Look at how many people use their real names and how few people caps lock their statements.  I&#8217;d call it the internet equivalent of an old fashioned Salon.</p>
<p>I believe that i first came here to read the Weekly Carboholic about a year ago.  I&#8217;ve never left because i felt immediately at home, and surmised that this is what the internet should be&#8230;or here is potentiality actualized. (And no, i&#8217;m not just saying that because i&#8217;ve been given the opportunity to post&#8230;for those non-regulars reading this.  I&#8217;m honored to have that opportunity because i feel that way about S&amp;R.)</p>
<p>Thanks for all your hard work.</p>
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