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	<title>Comments on: The stimulus bill, Iraq and &#8220;fiscal responsibility&#8221;</title>
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	<link>http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/2009/02/18/the-stimulus-bill-iraq-and-fiscal-responsibility/</link>
	<description>Think.  It ain&#039;t illegal yet...</description>
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		<title>By: jeff watson</title>
		<link>http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/2009/02/18/the-stimulus-bill-iraq-and-fiscal-responsibility/comment-page-1/#comment-63246</link>
		<dc:creator>jeff watson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Feb 2009 03:36:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/?p=7662#comment-63246</guid>
		<description>http://blogs.wsj.com/wealth/

Since this blog is ground zero for class envy, you ought to post this site on your blogroll.  Looking at that site before writing should get the juices really going.

Jeff</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://blogs.wsj.com/wealth/" rel="nofollow">http://blogs.wsj.com/wealth/</a></p>
<p>Since this blog is ground zero for class envy, you ought to post this site on your blogroll.  Looking at that site before writing should get the juices really going.</p>
<p>Jeff</p>
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		<title>By: jeff watson</title>
		<link>http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/2009/02/18/the-stimulus-bill-iraq-and-fiscal-responsibility/comment-page-1/#comment-63179</link>
		<dc:creator>jeff watson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Feb 2009 19:17:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/?p=7662#comment-63179</guid>
		<description>Fikshun,

You ought to study the past recessions and depressions to see just what the carnage was. We&#039;re nowhere near those levels, in fact we&#039;re much better than we were off in 1980.  There have been times in this country where 75% of the banks closed. There have been times where call money was going for 150%.  We&#039;ve had 30% unemployment, and real hunger...even in the last 80 years.  As recently as the 80&#039;s, banks were  closing left and right(more than 10%), not to mention the S&amp;L&#039;s. This is nothing compared to those times.  Anyways, you can&#039;t compare this recession to the last recession in 2001, as recessions differ.  As many financial people lost their jobs in 2001 as in this recession. You might want to look at 1970 or 1974 and see how ugly those numbers were. Go to 1907 or 1874 to see real ugly numbers.  

A good way to look at it is that recessions present as many opportunities for the sagacious person as full blown economic expansions.  There are countless opportunities right now for a person who thinks smart, dispassionately, and uses prescience in their thought process.

The trouble with most of the public is that they actually believe the 24 hour news cycle and get worked up.  Since people travel in herds, they are easily manipulated by the powers that be.  The key is to buck the herd, be an individual, think for yourself, act in your own self interest, and don&#039;t allow yourself to be spoon fed by the media

Here&#039;s a good video of what the people who will be paying for all this bailout crap think.
http://www.cnbc.com/id/15840232?video=1039849853&amp;play=1

Agree or not, y&#039;all will be entertained as it&#039;s from the floor of the CME, and Rick gets input from the floor traders on what they think of Obama&#039;s boondoggle. 

Jeff</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fikshun,</p>
<p>You ought to study the past recessions and depressions to see just what the carnage was. We&#8217;re nowhere near those levels, in fact we&#8217;re much better than we were off in 1980.  There have been times in this country where 75% of the banks closed. There have been times where call money was going for 150%.  We&#8217;ve had 30% unemployment, and real hunger&#8230;even in the last 80 years.  As recently as the 80&#8242;s, banks were  closing left and right(more than 10%), not to mention the S&amp;L&#8217;s. This is nothing compared to those times.  Anyways, you can&#8217;t compare this recession to the last recession in 2001, as recessions differ.  As many financial people lost their jobs in 2001 as in this recession. You might want to look at 1970 or 1974 and see how ugly those numbers were. Go to 1907 or 1874 to see real ugly numbers.  </p>
<p>A good way to look at it is that recessions present as many opportunities for the sagacious person as full blown economic expansions.  There are countless opportunities right now for a person who thinks smart, dispassionately, and uses prescience in their thought process.</p>
<p>The trouble with most of the public is that they actually believe the 24 hour news cycle and get worked up.  Since people travel in herds, they are easily manipulated by the powers that be.  The key is to buck the herd, be an individual, think for yourself, act in your own self interest, and don&#8217;t allow yourself to be spoon fed by the media</p>
<p>Here&#8217;s a good video of what the people who will be paying for all this bailout crap think.<br />
<a href="http://www.cnbc.com/id/15840232?video=1039849853&#038;play=1" rel="nofollow">http://www.cnbc.com/id/15840232?video=1039849853&#038;play=1</a></p>
<p>Agree or not, y&#8217;all will be entertained as it&#8217;s from the floor of the CME, and Rick gets input from the floor traders on what they think of Obama&#8217;s boondoggle. </p>
<p>Jeff</p>
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		<title>By: fikshun</title>
		<link>http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/2009/02/18/the-stimulus-bill-iraq-and-fiscal-responsibility/comment-page-1/#comment-63167</link>
		<dc:creator>fikshun</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Feb 2009 15:34:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/?p=7662#comment-63167</guid>
		<description>@ Jeff:  How many investment firms went under or got bought out in the last recession?  How many banks failed?  When was the last time you heard AIG say &quot;hey, if we don&#039;t get some money by tomorrow, we&#039;re done&quot;?  How many homes lost 40% of their value?  

It&#039;s too early to call this a depression, and I think a number of the layoffs we&#039;ve seen of late have been companies looking for an excuse to lay off people without looking like jerks, but still, this doesn&#039;t look like any of the recessions I&#039;ve been through.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ Jeff:  How many investment firms went under or got bought out in the last recession?  How many banks failed?  When was the last time you heard AIG say &#8220;hey, if we don&#8217;t get some money by tomorrow, we&#8217;re done&#8221;?  How many homes lost 40% of their value?  </p>
<p>It&#8217;s too early to call this a depression, and I think a number of the layoffs we&#8217;ve seen of late have been companies looking for an excuse to lay off people without looking like jerks, but still, this doesn&#8217;t look like any of the recessions I&#8217;ve been through.</p>
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		<title>By: Dr. Slammy</title>
		<link>http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/2009/02/18/the-stimulus-bill-iraq-and-fiscal-responsibility/comment-page-1/#comment-63125</link>
		<dc:creator>Dr. Slammy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Feb 2009 04:02:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/?p=7662#comment-63125</guid>
		<description>Hey Mike, watch this.

KRUGMAN!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Mike, watch this.</p>
<p>KRUGMAN!</p>
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		<title>By: Ubertramp</title>
		<link>http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/2009/02/18/the-stimulus-bill-iraq-and-fiscal-responsibility/comment-page-1/#comment-63123</link>
		<dc:creator>Ubertramp</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Feb 2009 03:25:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/?p=7662#comment-63123</guid>
		<description>Hahaha.  I wish I knew enough to help ya on this one, Jeff, but I&#039;m afraid yer on yer own again.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hahaha.  I wish I knew enough to help ya on this one, Jeff, but I&#8217;m afraid yer on yer own again.</p>
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		<title>By: jeff watson</title>
		<link>http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/2009/02/18/the-stimulus-bill-iraq-and-fiscal-responsibility/comment-page-1/#comment-63119</link>
		<dc:creator>jeff watson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Feb 2009 03:03:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/?p=7662#comment-63119</guid>
		<description>Actually the New Deal sucked, kind of like the present stimulus package, but the GI Bill is probably one of the best things ever done to increase the prosperity of this country.  Not everything FDR did was bad....OK, most of it was, but not everything.

Jeff</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Actually the New Deal sucked, kind of like the present stimulus package, but the GI Bill is probably one of the best things ever done to increase the prosperity of this country.  Not everything FDR did was bad&#8230;.OK, most of it was, but not everything.</p>
<p>Jeff</p>
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		<title>By: Ubertramp</title>
		<link>http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/2009/02/18/the-stimulus-bill-iraq-and-fiscal-responsibility/comment-page-1/#comment-63117</link>
		<dc:creator>Ubertramp</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Feb 2009 02:56:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/?p=7662#comment-63117</guid>
		<description>I can already hear the gears in Jeff&#039;s head grinding themselves to nubs about that FDR comment.  :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I can already hear the gears in Jeff&#8217;s head grinding themselves to nubs about that FDR comment.  <img src='http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Dr. Slammy</title>
		<link>http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/2009/02/18/the-stimulus-bill-iraq-and-fiscal-responsibility/comment-page-1/#comment-63111</link>
		<dc:creator>Dr. Slammy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Feb 2009 01:42:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/?p=7662#comment-63111</guid>
		<description>Mike: I think #2 is the key. If the public comes away with hard evidence that - gasp - direct government spending IS an answer, it&#039;s bad news for the &quot;government isn&#039;t the answer to your problems, government IS your problem&quot; crowd. Fact: the golden age of American prosperity that so many like to wax fondly about was a fairly direct result of a bunch of evil gummit spending by FDR.

If we get to that point, the GOP is gonna be needing a new message that sounds a whole lot different from the old one.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mike: I think #2 is the key. If the public comes away with hard evidence that &#8211; gasp &#8211; direct government spending IS an answer, it&#8217;s bad news for the &#8220;government isn&#8217;t the answer to your problems, government IS your problem&#8221; crowd. Fact: the golden age of American prosperity that so many like to wax fondly about was a fairly direct result of a bunch of evil gummit spending by FDR.</p>
<p>If we get to that point, the GOP is gonna be needing a new message that sounds a whole lot different from the old one.</p>
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		<title>By: jeff watson</title>
		<link>http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/2009/02/18/the-stimulus-bill-iraq-and-fiscal-responsibility/comment-page-1/#comment-63107</link>
		<dc:creator>jeff watson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Feb 2009 01:00:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/?p=7662#comment-63107</guid>
		<description>Is there any hard evidence that this is not a typical recession in a typical cycle? 

Jeff</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Is there any hard evidence that this is not a typical recession in a typical cycle? </p>
<p>Jeff</p>
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		<title>By: fikshun</title>
		<link>http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/2009/02/18/the-stimulus-bill-iraq-and-fiscal-responsibility/comment-page-1/#comment-63101</link>
		<dc:creator>fikshun</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Feb 2009 00:24:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/?p=7662#comment-63101</guid>
		<description>Nice anger.  I believe Dr. Thompson would have involved leeches as well.

As best as I can tell, the Republican strategy to regain control of Washington goes something like this:

1) Deny our current state of affairs is anything more than a typical recession in a typical cycle.  This has the effect of a) making it look as though you&#039;d been doing nothing wrong over the last eight years and b) allowing you to say &quot;I told you so&quot; if the stimulus plan actually works.

2) Do everything in your power to stop or gut the stimulus plan.  If the economy begins growing quickly and public opinion believes it&#039;s the result of the stimulus package, the Republicans can kiss off any hope of power for the foreseeable future.  If it fails, they can say &quot;see, it was unavoidable and now we&#039;re in bigger trouble because of those &#039;tax and spend&#039; Democrats&quot;.

I don&#039;t like the idea of racking up any more national debt, but we seem to have found ourselves in the &quot;damned if you do, damned if you don&#039;t&quot; predicament.  At the end of the day, it seems like we&#039;re just federalizing defaulted mortgages.  Hopefully, our lenders will have the gaul to believe that we, as a nation, are still good for the money.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nice anger.  I believe Dr. Thompson would have involved leeches as well.</p>
<p>As best as I can tell, the Republican strategy to regain control of Washington goes something like this:</p>
<p>1) Deny our current state of affairs is anything more than a typical recession in a typical cycle.  This has the effect of a) making it look as though you&#8217;d been doing nothing wrong over the last eight years and b) allowing you to say &#8220;I told you so&#8221; if the stimulus plan actually works.</p>
<p>2) Do everything in your power to stop or gut the stimulus plan.  If the economy begins growing quickly and public opinion believes it&#8217;s the result of the stimulus package, the Republicans can kiss off any hope of power for the foreseeable future.  If it fails, they can say &#8220;see, it was unavoidable and now we&#8217;re in bigger trouble because of those &#8216;tax and spend&#8217; Democrats&#8221;.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t like the idea of racking up any more national debt, but we seem to have found ourselves in the &#8220;damned if you do, damned if you don&#8217;t&#8221; predicament.  At the end of the day, it seems like we&#8217;re just federalizing defaulted mortgages.  Hopefully, our lenders will have the gaul to believe that we, as a nation, are still good for the money.</p>
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		<title>By: Lex</title>
		<link>http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/2009/02/18/the-stimulus-bill-iraq-and-fiscal-responsibility/comment-page-1/#comment-63100</link>
		<dc:creator>Lex</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Feb 2009 00:17:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/?p=7662#comment-63100</guid>
		<description>Bravo, bravo and bravo!

I tell ya, i feel the same way when certain groups of politicians start doing the &quot;small government&quot; routine.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bravo, bravo and bravo!</p>
<p>I tell ya, i feel the same way when certain groups of politicians start doing the &#8220;small government&#8221; routine.</p>
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		<title>By: Savantster</title>
		<link>http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/2009/02/18/the-stimulus-bill-iraq-and-fiscal-responsibility/comment-page-1/#comment-63069</link>
		<dc:creator>Savantster</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Feb 2009 19:46:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/?p=7662#comment-63069</guid>
		<description>Tell us how you _really_ feel :D

While I don&#039;t like most politicians, the Repubs are the biggest liars and abusers out there. I just don&#039;t understand how most of those that vote for them can be _that_ stupid.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tell us how you _really_ feel <img src='http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif' alt=':D' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>While I don&#8217;t like most politicians, the Repubs are the biggest liars and abusers out there. I just don&#8217;t understand how most of those that vote for them can be _that_ stupid.</p>
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